Meditation Q&A

What is the concept of Moksha here? Because you say that Karpat is God also. We try to attain God, that's what your self-realisation that you are talking about. Exactly.

So, everything is God, why do we attain God? Actually, everything is God, it is human language we attain God. No, we don't attain God, we just realise that everything is God. What is the concept of Moksha in this case? Once we have that knowledge, this idea of differentiation will vanish, this duality itself will vanish.

I will give you a simple example. Here is a table, here is a stool, here is a chair. What do you see? Here is a table, here is a stool, here is a chair.

How many objects you are seeing? Three of them. Now, what is the common thing among all these three? All of them are made out of wood. Once you realise it is wood, then the differentiation will vanish from our minds.

That means you say, I am a Hindu, you are a Christian, I am a human being. Extension of this knowledge, we are all of the manifestations of the same God. Then you see, there is no hatred, there is no fear, you don't tell lies to your own self.

This is what I am telling is external behaviour will change. But ultimately we realise that we are all of the same nature as God. So this is a kind of preparation I said, meditation, which will lead to the highest realisation.

After that, if we come back from that state, then we again see clear manifestation of God in everything. If we don't return, we become completely one with and remain there. This is called moksha or complete liberation.

So, in the process of attaining this moksha, a person dies on the 3rd floor and... Our Hindus, you are a Hindu? I am not a Hindu, I am a Christian by the way. Okay, Hindus you know, they believe in reincarnation, right? So when a Hindu believes, a person stops at a particular stage of spiritual evolution, he doesn't start all over again. He will get another instrument, just like, suppose you are writing something, your pen becomes spoiled, you get another pen and continue writing, right? That is the idea Hindus have.

We take up exactly where we have left over, continue further until we reach our goal. Yeah. I have a question there.

Yes. If I can ask, I hope I am not... Please ask. Please.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, go ahead. So you were saying that wherever we die, we left off at that particular place and then in the next life, according to reincarnation, you take it from that point and go forward. So if a person continues to do bad works, because one of the philosophies of Hinduism is to believe that good works will lead to heaven, I think you must have heard a lot about that.

Yes, yes. So if the person is not doing good works, and if he dies, and if he is a bad person, if he dies, and if he is whatever way, then in his next life, will he take up what he was left off with or will he be born again as a lower creature? It is possible. Hindus, you know what we are talking, logically we cannot prove.

You must always remember. These are all beliefs. If you are asking that can you give a proof, I cannot.

I can only say this is what I believe, Hindus believe. So Hindus believe that a bad person accumulates what is called samskara, the impressions or habitual impressions. Therefore, if a bad person does bad things, then he goes appropriate punishment, then he will be given another chance to reform himself.

So the result of next birth will be he might even become non-human being depending upon what he does. But ultimately he will come back to the human birth, and he will be given another chance, and another chance, and another chance, because you see if you have got a headache, you want to keep quiet, you want to get rid of your headache. So if the result of evil actions is suffering, nobody wants to suffer, else he will start thinking why am I suffering.

Then you see he will find out ultimately maybe because of my bad behaviour. Then he will be acquiring a good behaviour, and he will continue his progress further. So this is what Hindus believe.

I have two more questions. Okay. In this particular process, in this present life, right now my name is Vijay, by the way.

In this life I am known as Vijay. If I die, if I don't do good works, I don't know how many good works that I need to do according to Hindu religion to get to heaven, I don't know. So if I die, I have no chance in this life.

If I die, because this is reality right now, in this life I don't have another chance. So at the end of a particular person's life, the last day of the last hour, he thinks that I am a bad person, I have done all the bad things, and I want to do good things, set myself straight, and then he dies before he sets himself straight, before doing his good works. Yeah.

You see, he will have to pay a little bit of, in the form of suffering, but he will again come back as a human being. In this life. Yeah.

Yeah. You know, I can only give an illustration to give a little idea about it. Suppose somebody had committed a crime.

So the government will punish him, puts him behind a jail. Just before going to jail he might realise that I have done something bad I should not have done. So you know, the punishment cannot be avoided by that.

Having lived in the jail for some time, he will come out, then he has all the opportunity to reform himself. This is every religion, no religion condemns anybody for eternity. This is only temporary thing.

Then until we reach God, we will have opportunity to go on correcting ourselves, to become better. Yes, but you know, we need not make big deal of this life or next life. After all, what is there? Life is... Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, you know, even from a worldly point of view, your question is very pertinent. Supposing somebody is a drunkard.

He realises just before death, I have drunk, I should not have drunk. There is no chance. You know, he is good, but next birth he has a chance, according to Hindus, that he need not drink.

Choice is always there. But in this life, I'm sorry, it is finished, you know, it is at the end of it. That's the question.

That's the answer that I was asking. Yes, yes. Yes.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Concept... Yeah. Yes, Hinduism has both a concept of hell and a concept of heaven. Both are temporary periods of life for experiencing something, the result of something good or something evil.

That's all, you know. Suppose you work very hard and you earn a lot of money. Then you can go on a holiday and enjoy it, come back.

But nobody will enjoy holiday forever. As long as your money lasts, you are on a holiday. Then you come back and again start working.

Also, if you do something wrong, you will have to suffer for some time, but again you will recuperate, come back, and again continue your journey. This is how Hindus believe until we discover God, this journey goes on. Moksha is eternal.

Moksha is not temporary. I said... Hell and heaven, both. Now... Yes.

Yes, yes. Moksha and... Yes, yes, yes. One with the spirit.

And you become one with the spirit. Okay. Thanks for the time.

Sadhguruji, I have a question. Yes. I saw the tape of Ramayan, the movie you made, and there was a question for Ram asked by Lakshman when he tried to kill Bharat and he thought he is going to attack Ram.

And then, you know, Panchavati, he was asking, I cannot forgive myself thinking of him. I did a crime. And then Sita told, No, when you repent for that and you came out from all sin and you became pure, so don't worry about anything.

You've done bad. If you think you've done bad and you can repent for that and you became totally pure person. So, that's maybe you can do that.

Realisation for the mistake and maybe God forgive for that. We are talking here two different things. One, if somebody thinks bad of somebody else and subsequently realises that was not the right thing to do, repentance is alright because both are mental acts.

Thinking bad also is a mental act. Repenting is also a mental act. But if this mental act translates itself into a concrete physical action, that reaction has got to be countered with.

Suppose you are very angry with yourself and subsequently you realise you should not have been angry. So, both are mental acts. It will give you peace.

But when you are very angry, you go and put your finger in the fire. In that case, repentance is good for the mental action, but you need some salve for putting on your burnt finger. That is the concept of karma phala.

It is said, mental sin is no sin. Mental sin is only fancy. How many people you know you might have killed in your mind as a mental fancy, God knows.

But we should never express them into concrete actions. That's bad. It is natural.

You can get angry. Stop it there. Even that is not too good because if you are perpetually angry, then your husband's health will be very, very good.

Don't do it. Of course, did you hear that story? Yesterday? Okay. That's fine.

No, no. You ask other people. You know, because they also will remember it.

Absolutely. There are two concepts here. You know, according to Hinduism, God is, Ishwara is karma adhyaksha, the lord of the karmas.

So, if we have done something wrong and according to natural law, we have to pay equal amount of punishment, but God says, okay, my grace is upon you. I cancel your karma phala. Don't worry.

Or I will let you, if you have to pay $10,000 debt, I will give you $9,999. You just pay $1. Your debt is cancelled.

So, this is one concept. The other concept is by doing spiritual practise, you may get the full karma phala, but your mental attitude will not allow you to suffer so much because suffering is in the mind. Is it not? So, I give this example.

Suppose you are caught in a traffic jam and what can you do? There are various ways. You can say that it is horrible thing. You know, Nisha, the origination of Haribol.

One Englishman in Calcutta where summer night it was so muggy and he was repeating Haribol, Haribol. His neighbours heard him and said, what a great Bhagwat. He is always, whole night he is repeating Haribol, Haribol.

Did you know that? Haribol. So, the other is if we have the right attitude, then the suffering becomes actually hallowed. It may be very minimum.

And that's what, you know, once we accept, the greatest suffering also becomes very bearable. Not only that, there is something very interesting. There are some saints who not only do not ask for prevention of suffering, they actively pray, O Lord, grant me suffering.

You know that? Kunti is an example of that. Because she said, when we are in suffering, then Krishna was always with us. Swamiji, chanting Vishnu Sahasranama, Lalita Sahasranama is a form of sadhana.

It is not only a wonderful form of sadhana, it is also very therapeutic. Especially I know about Lalita Sahasranama. If a mentally sick patient, if somebody repeats, there are many things like that.

Another is Mahamrityunjaya Mantra. How it works, don't ask me, because I also can't explain. The point is, it works.

Suppose it doesn't work. What? Iddiham? You are only repeating God's name? This is not to say that, you know, like some fanatics, that one should not take medicine or consult a doctor. Along with all those things, this is a spiritual activity that can go on.

It's a wonderful Vishnu Sahasranama. It creates a beautiful atmosphere. That is why in church, in temple and in mosque, this beautiful Gregorian chanting goes on, you know, Vedic chanting.

So therapeutic, Vedic chanting. Is it important to chant this loudly or can you do it mentally? Does it have like other effects different? You know, both have their own effects. If you can chant nicely, that has its, you know, sound has its own effect.

For example, if somebody can sing beautifully, it has an effect. We have seen it. If somebody cannot sing, they can sing mentally, because the devotion is more important, even more important than, you know, just chanting loudly.

It works both ways. When you are in a mood, sing. When you are not in a mood, just do it silently a little bit.

It's fine. The important thing is to direct our attention towards God. That is the only thing.

In one of the readings, you know, I came across this statement that you can get the grace of God and the grace of the Guru, but without the grace of your mind, you won't be able to make spiritual progress. Yeah. So, could you clarify what that means? Very nice statement.

In Bengali language, this is the, you know, there is Guru Kripa, there is Divine Grace, Bhagavad Kripa. But for the lack of one, no, there is three graces are there. Grace of God and grace of Guru and grace of Vaishnava.

But for the lack of one, man courted ruin. What is that? Grace of one's own mind. It is, what is this? It's like this.

Suppose you are a mother and you have a baby and you love your baby and you prepared most delicious dishes for your baby and you wanted to feed your baby, but the baby's stomach is bad. Can you feed? Can he enjoy? So, that is the idea. Our mind should be very receptive.

Here, grace of mind means it should be receptive for receiving the grace which is coming. We are all really blessed. God is so gracious to us, really speaking.

We have good physical body, good brain and the company of good satsang, you know, what is called Mahapurusha Samsrayaha and Momukshita, desire for spiritual life. But somehow our own minds are the only obstructions. We have to make use of it.

What do you mean by gracious? Our own mind is gracious. First of all, we have to value the blessings of God. When we, suppose we can see how wonderful it is, suppose we lose our sight, then only we realise how valuable our eyes are.

Is it not? Often. When we are sick, then we realise how valuable this human life has been when we were healthy. So, like that.

Then there are other aspects to it. We are human beings. We commit mistakes.

It is very natural to be committing. We are weak. So, here also there is a distinction according to us between committing a sin and what is called weakness.

We are not sinners. We are not cutting the throats of other people. We are not robbing other people.

But we have some weaknesses. We want to eat some nice sweet. We want to smoke.

We want to occasionally drink. We want to watch some movie. These are weaknesses.

Weakness and sin are not to be identified. Still weakness is an obstruction. No doubt about it.

But it is not a sin because we are not actually causing harm to other people. So, we have to be forgiving ourselves. You can forgive other people.

Why can't you forgive yourself? After all, what is so great in you? Is it not? Do you understand what I am talking? If you have committed a mistake, you say, Lord, I am weak. I have committed a mistake. I will try not to commit the same mistake again.

But you feel very guilty. How stupid I have been. You know, there was one husband and he was always boasting to his wife.

You know what he was boasting? They had a son. He said, You see, our son inherited all my brains. Wife said, That explains why you are behaving so idiotically ever since he was born.

Right? We are so proud as though we cannot commit a mistake. Why can't we commit a mistake? We are also human beings. So, let us be forgiving to ourselves.

This is very important point. You have to keep it in mind. Suppose we should have done something.

We have not done. Now it is too late. Maybe somebody is dead.

What is the point in regretting about what is past? Now let us see what is the best we can do under these circumstances. Sri Ramakrishna was a very wonderful teacher. That's why he said, What? I have taken the name of God.

Why should I go on regretting again? This is the strength of the divine name, faith, bhakti. Otherwise, you know, we feel ourselves proud. See how great devotee I am.

I am going on thinking about my own weakness. Is he thinking of God? Or is he thinking of himself? Yes. We are talking about sin here, right? You are mentioning that anything that we think in our heart is not sin.

Anything in our... Yeah. And also you are talking about sin and weakness. Yeah.

So, is it not the ignorance of God's sin? Hindus... I can only talk about Hindus' concept. So, you know what we think. It is like this.

Suppose some thought arises in your mind. You are angry. You want to beat up somebody.

As long as you do not express it in concrete action, it remains only in the form of thought. Therefore, it is much easier to overcome it. I am not saying that you can go on thinking all sinful thoughts.

What happens is if you go on with... You just mentioned you can't go on thinking sinful thoughts. Exactly. And you are mentioning right there the thoughts themselves sinful.

No, no, no. What I am saying if we go on thinking wrong thoughts, sooner or later they might express themselves into concrete actions. So, if we can be aware I am thinking bad thoughts, it is easier to put a stop to it.

In that sense, it is not a licence for thinking wrong thoughts. So, the second thing is we are all weak people. We might even have committed sins.

But what can be done? It is done. But there is a chance for us. God can forgive us.

So, let us depend upon God's grace and see that we do not commit the same things again. That's very important. You asked if ignorance of God is sin, right? That was the question.

You said if ignorance of God is sin, I think Swami... Yeah, yeah. That is an aspect. Why do we do these bad things? Because we are unaware of our own divine nature or the divine nature of God.

If I am thinking of God, where is the place for sin? If I am only thinking of myself as a human being, then these thoughts will arise. So, what Hindus think is however bad we have been, there is always hope for reformation. That's what we Christians think too.

We ask for forgiveness. Yes, yes. That should involve these two elements.

Lord, I have committed. Now I can't undo what I had done. So, you please forgive me so I do not need to suffer.

But at the same time, I am promising you that I will not repeat what I had done in the past. Whatever you call it. Yeah.

And you ask God for forgiveness. So, where is this concept of forgiveness? He doesn't even think of God for forgiveness. Ignorance of God itself.

He doesn't even think of God. So, where is the question of asking for forgiveness? Is she right? Ignorance of God. That was my basic question.

You see, Hindus and Christians what is sin according to Christians, what is called ignorance of God. It is a sin in the sense that it leads to worldliness, selfishness, etc. But the moment we are aware of God, all these problems will slowly be overcome.

Swami, do I ask that question? Yeah. Because you know scriptures and Jesus says that the adultery is sin. Not just the physical act of it is sin.

But Jesus said if you look at a woman with lust in your heart, then you have already committed adultery and hence you have committed a sin. So, I am thinking from that point of view and then you are talking about weaknesses and then if you feel something inside it is not sin but if it produces something, kind of an outward action, that is sin. No, no.

Let me understand what you are saying. Let me explain a little bit what it is, you know, that the moment our heart returns to God, in the beginning, you know, we are thinking a little bit of God, we are coming back again to our old nature, etc. There is a kind of battle going on, spiritual warfare it is called.

So, what I said that by God's grace slowly we are going to reform ourselves and then what happens is when a person reaches that state where his mind is most of the time only feeling the presence of God, even the slightest forgetfulness of God produces tremendous feeling of guilt and repentance. From that point of view, Jesus Christ is telling if a man thinks, looks upon a woman with what is called lustful eye, he had already committed adultery, if you apply that rule for ordinary people, they are never going to attain anywhere, go anywhere. What is important is suppose, you know, somebody commits this one, he feels guilty, then you call and say, yes, Jesus Christ said, you are a very guilty fellow, you are a sinner, you are condemned, then instead of thinking of God more, he will only go down.

Encourage him and say, yes, you have done something bad, it is mental sin, no sin, now you do not do the same thing, don't feel guilty, instead of wasting your time on guilty feeling, then now you think more of God, this is how slowly, slowly you will improve. This is the idea. If we do not do what happens, again the same thing will be repeated, where is the progress? Until you reach God, not good enough.

Until you reach Moksha, not good enough. Om.