Chandogya Upanishad 3.14.2-4 Lecture 125 on 02 August 2025

Sanskrit Invocation

Oṁ jananīṁ śaradāṁ devīṁ rāmakṛṣṇam jagad-gurum pāda-padmetayōśritvā praṇamāmi-mohurumō

Oṁ āpyāyantu mamāṅgāni vākprāṇas cakṣuḥ śrutra-mathu bala-mindriyāṇi ca sarvāṇi sarvam brahmau paṇiṣadam māham brahma nirākuriyām mā mā brahma nirākarot anirākaraṇam astva nirākaraṇam me astu tadātmani nirate yau paṇiṣadsu dharmā te mayi santu te mayi santu

Oṁ śānte śānte śānte

Hāre he Oṁ

Translation

May my limbs, speech, vital force, eyes, ears, as also strength and all the organs become well developed. Everything is the Brahman revealed in the Upanishads. May I not deny Brahman. May not Brahman deny me. Let there be no spurning of me by Brahman. Let there be no rejection of Brahman by me. May all the virtues that are spoken of in the Upanishads repose in me who am engaged in the pursuit of the Self. May they repose in me. Om. Peace. Peace. Peace be unto all.

Sandilya Vidya: The Vision of Universal Brahman

Introduction to Sandilya Vidya

We were discussing a special type of Upasana called Sandilya Vidya. There was a great realized soul called Sandilya and he specially had propagated this particular Vidya and what is the Sandilya Vidya or essence of this Sandilya Vidya? That is the entire creation is none other than Brahman. It is Brahman only. Therefore the Vidya or Upasana is learn to see Brahman in everything.

The Teaching of Seeing God Everywhere

In plain words it means that the entire universe tries to see God like Prahlada, see God everywhere. When Prahlada's father Hiranyakashipu asked him, where is your Narayana? Hiranyakashipu wants to see Narayana. The answer Prahlada gave was not that he is somewhere, here or there, but he is everywhere. But why am I not able to see him? That's because of your impurity, ignorance. So when you purify, when your eyes are smeared with the paste of knowledge, Of course he could not do it.

The Symbolism of Hiranyakashipu's Story

Hiranyakashipu, then he broke the pillar. A story with deep symbolism. That means he strived his best. What is the meaning of breaking the pillar? Pillar means the sense that I am an individual. I am a small being. I am so and so. And he broke that one. Then from inside, as the story goes, Lord himself had manifested as what? As a destroyer of ignorance. So the killing of Hiranyakashipu's body is an indication that Bhagawan, and only Bhagawan can do that, has destroyed out of His infinite mercy. And that mercy is always there. But as Ramakrishna says, we have to unfurl the sails. And Hiranyakashipu, by this story, he broke the pillar, means I do not exist anymore. Only you are the word. That is called complete self surrender, saranagati. Unnaturally Bhagawan destroyed whatever remnants are there so that Hiranyakashipu or so called that individual soul now became one with Paramatma.

The Realization of Universal Brahman

So that is what we need to see. See God everywhere. When we start seeing God everywhere, we also realize we are also part of that universe only. Therefore we are not excluded from it. And then when we see Brahman everywhere, such a person also sees, I am Brahman, understands I am Brahman. In fact, only with that knowledge, I am Brahman, comes out the vision, everyone is also Brahman. As we are, so the whole world is. So that is what Sandili Rishi wants to tell.

The Analogy of Clay and Pot

And what is the reason? The reason is just as a pot is a manifestation of clay, but only with name and form. And even though it is appearing as name and form, it is nothing but clay. There is no object called name or form. The object is only clay. And for some time it will be there like that. But in the end, that name and form also will merge back into from where it came. This is the inevitable law. A tree gives birth to a seed, and a seed gives birth to a plant, and again the plant goes back into a seed form. This is called the wheel of Brahman, Brahmachakra.

The Absolute Nature of Brahman

So the whole universe has come from Brahman. It is sustained by Brahman, and it goes back into Brahman. Therefore I do not exist, you do not exist, nothing else exists. Only Brahman exists. And for that we have given any number of times the example, the analogy of dream. Even in dream we consider ourselves as separate, but upon waking up we understand the whole dream world has come out of me, was maintained, sustained by me, and when I wake up it goes back into myself. So this was the special declaration of Sandalya Rishi, and that is what is called Sandalya Vidya, Sarvam Kalvidam Brahma. Everything that we experience through our body and mind is nothing but Brahma. That is the essence of the first very mantra.

The Role of Faith (Shraddha)

But then how to realize that one? So a person must develop intense faith. A man is what his faith is. You tell me about your faith and I will tell you who you are. So here the word used is Kratu. A man is Shraddha Mayaha, because whatever he thinks is real, true. Believes as real. He desires only that one. He strives only to attain that one. And he cannot do otherwise. So develop that Kratu. And then the mantra also tells us whatever a man's faith is, that is what determines not only the present life, but the future life, all future lives. But finally the Shraddha culminates in complete faith in the scriptures, which say Tattvamasi, the what, that, and everything is Brahman. So a person realizes Aham Brahmasmi. Thereafter he realizes nothing else exists other than Brahman. Sarvam Kalvidam Brahma. And therefore let a man develop Shraddha. And all spiritual practices are only to develop this Shraddha in the scripture, which is the same as developing Shraddha in one's own Guru.

The Unity of God, Scripture, and Guru

So if anybody says, I have faith in God, and do not have faith in scriptures, or if anybody says, I have faith in my Guru, but don't believe in God or scripture, or vice versa, he doesn't understand what he is talking about. And the rest of the mantras are only a brief expansion of the essence we discussed just now.

The Second Mantra: Smaller than the Smallest, Greater than the Greatest

So in the second mantra he is telling, Ano Ranyan Mahato Mahiyan. So this Brahman, he is everywhere, he is everything, he is smaller than the smallest, he is bigger than the biggest. To facilitate easier understanding, the Upanishad gives certain examples. The Brahman is Aniyan, subtler, smaller, subtler than what Vriherva, Yavadva, Sarshapadva, Shyamakatva, Shyamakatandulatva. So Vedic times, Upanishadic times, all these so-called grains must have, food materials must have been in vogue, otherwise the mention would not have come. So rice was there, barley was there, mustard was there, millet was there, and there is one type of millet, it is called Shyamakatandula. That is very, very fine, small millet.

Examples of Brahman's Vastness

So these are all themselves small, but the Lord, Brahman, is bigger than all of them. But what about the big ones, the whole cosmos? So that is also said, jayan prathibhya, jayan antarakshat, jayan devo, jayan evyo loke bhyaha. Not only the Atman or Brahman is smaller than the smallest, subtler than the subtlest, grosser than the grossest, greater than the greatest, because it is everything. So for that also is an example, jayan prathibhya, even our earth, if you draw a map of the earth and in that you draw the place where you are.

The Cosmic Perspective

In fact, once I saw on the internet some beautiful map, our cosmos, not our galaxy, not outside our galaxy, has been given in the form of dots, a map full of dots. And this is our cosmos. And in that earth, very small, tiny, like the mark that can be had, you dip the edge of a needle in ink and put it there. And in that small space, our whole earth, so India is even smaller, and Varanasi is even smaller, and the home of service I live in is even the smallest. So it cannot even be found out. And all these things are contained within the Brahman, that is to say every manifestation of existence is nothing but Brahman.

Finding Brahman Within

So where is this Atman? In other words, it is not where is Narayana? Where is Brahman? How can I realize Brahman? That is the real intention. Where can I see him? First to try to see within yourself. This is the song that this Chandogya Upanishad sings whether it is the 6th chapter, 7th chapter, 8th chapter, we see that So this body is called Brahmapuri, and within that there is a Dharakasha, and within that Dharakasha the Brahman is there smaller than the smallest. That is only to say that this so-called smaller than the smallest contains bigger than the biggest.

Sri Ramakrishna's Illustration

Sri Ramakrishna gives a beautiful story. I am sure all of you remember that. I think Ishan Chandra Mukhopadhyay must have told that one. Sri Ramakrishna asks him, you tell about how a devotee is greater than God. So he says are contained within the stomach of the Divine Lord, so he is the biggest. But that biggest Divine Lord is contained in the heart of a devotee. Therefore who is bigger now? The heart of the devotee which contains. And this heart is within the devotee. So who is the greatest now? The devotee is greatest, greater than even God himself. This is a way of illustration to say there is no difference between God and his devotee.

Hanuman's Teaching on Unity

That's what Sri Ramakrishna in his inimitable style quotes Hanuman and says as we progress so we see that God is the master, I am the servant. When I advance as a soul that God is the Brahman, I am a small part of him. But when I reach the pinnacle of realization there is no difference between me and Brahman. This is contained in that most beautiful shloka supposedly to have been uttered by Hanuman. So that is the philosophy or teaching of Sri Ramakrishna also.

The Fourteen Lokas and States of Consciousness

And as I mentioned beautiful Bengali song Kali Rudare Pramhanda Bhanda, this entire cosmos creation because what we know about creation is very little. We are only talking about the gross external creation which is unimaginable but there are subtler and subtler worlds of which science has no news at all. How do I know? Because in Sri Ramakrishna at the vision when he wanted to find out who Narendra was he was describing that his mind started ascending to subtler and subtler realms and every realm a great God is ruling over and that power and the knowledge of that God doesn't exceed more than where he is residing but greater than that there are other worlds they can't even look up into the higher world.

Ramakrishna's Vision of the Saptarishis

Finally Ramakrishna said I travelled through that spiritual path and reached the realm of the Saptarishis. Rishi by the way means truth those who live in truth is called a Rishi. So Satya Krista and there he had the vision we know that so I am not going to repeat it. So the point is Hinduism posits 14 lokas are there and these 14 lokas are nothing but 14 states of our consciousness. If our consciousness is manifesting very little it becomes grossest, thickest and the corresponding experience of happiness also will be smallest unhappiness will be greatest. Similarly when we transcend our earthly concept the higher and higher lokas called the seven lokas ending in Brahma loka or Satya loka then our consciousness expands correspondingly our knowledge and our being and our bliss also expands and these are not to be measured by any telescope or microscope they have to be experienced personally and the very first step is to give up this body and go within and that is indicated here that this Atman or Brahman and they are not two different things is greater than the greatest smaller than the smallest, subtler than the subtlest and greater than the greatest and where is it? It is everywhere but one has to see it first where it is the nearest and that nearest place is our own heart.

The Heart as the Center of Realization

Here heart means starts with faith, faith produces corresponding thoughts and those thoughts slowly expand into activities and the activity is I am seeing God, I am serving God and finally like Arjuna beholds universal vision sahasrasirsa purusha, sahasraksha sahasrapad etc. That is what is called Asha Ma Atma Antaha Radhe this is the essence of the third mantra with which we have concluded so here we have to be cautious as what is it? This little thing that is called my self referred to as Asha Ma Atma is bigger than this vast cosmos is not merely as fine as a millet seed but faster than this whole earth and this entire creation it is faster than all the worlds not merely this one cosmos larger than even the heavens, subtler worlds even it is far superior to Brahma Loka or Satya Loka in fact Brahman is infinite but Satya Loka is not infinite it is finite and how many finites do we have to mix up, add together to make one infinite, infinite number of finites mixed together, combined together will it become infinite? Absolutely no, purnasya purnam adaya purnam eva avasya shyate so that is being said here so vast is the subjectivity objectivity and magnitude being infinite in its expanse and that this expanse of infinite is in me, in you in every one of us and it is shining like a small flame of light, Asha Ma Antar Hardaye so this symbology is given only for the purpose of upasana or contemplation because it has to be taught to us that it is not merely an infinite expanse outside world unconnected with us, no it is connected so the Upanishads are never tired of hammering that the supreme being is both objectively infinite and subjectively also is the self of everyone this is the principle meditation of every part of any Upanishad ultimately what is the essence then Swami Vivekananda was teaching privately to some chosen disciples at Thousand Island Park, there was a old doctor and he summarized Swami Vivekananda's teachings and said so Swami everything is Brahman is this not what you want to convey at the end of every class and Swamiji said there after he started making fun whenever this doctor enters into the classroom Swamiji will say here comes Brahman so this vast infinitude incomprehensible to the mind and yet nothing can be so near to us as that, it is so distant at the distant horizons because of the infinitude and yet as near as to be well nigh, inseparable from us because it is the atman itself that is called upa means the nearest, nearest means that which is everything that was what we discussed in our last class, today's class the last mantra in the Sandalya Vidya so the Rishi is repeating, repetition is one of the strategic strategic attitudes taken by every teacher, is very interesting if you are really interested take a whole of this Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna, put it into Chhatjipati and tell us give me in ten or in one sentence what is the essence of this whole Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna and then it will squeeze out Sarvam Kalvidam Brahma that is the essence of the Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna or any Upanishad Bhagavad Gita, any scripture, any religion, any sage saint even those who are going to be born they will teach you only the same way, how come because that is the truth and anybody who experiences the truth cannot tell anything else other than that truth, so here is a repetition of what we saw earlier this is the fourth mantra the last mantra in this Sandalya Vidya propagated taught by Sandalya Rishi.

The Fourth and Final Mantra

He whose creation is all that exists, whose are all the pure desires, who possesses all the agreeable orders and all the present tastes, who exists who exists pervading all this who is without speech and who is free from hesitation and eagerness, he is my Atman presiding in the lotus of my heart he is Brahman, on departing hence I shall attain to his being, he alone who possesses this faith and has no doubt about it will obtain the result thus declared Sandilya Sandilya thus declared Sandilya, Sandilya aha Sandilya aha, so as we saw earlier also whenever there is a repetition it means end of a section, it could be end of a chapter or it could be end of the whole book, the whole scripture, so here that is what it means there is nothing left out which I am going to tell you in the next class everything in the end of this one and let us analyse this one, it is so beautiful actually so what is it telling in this mantra for so this Brahman is Sarva Karma, now let us recollect, I told you whenever we are thinking of creation we can think of creation as the three bodies, the gross, subtle and causal or as pancha koshas or the five layers because of these layers we are not able to see what is hidden within what is covered within that Brahman is all the pancha all the five covers and yet Brahman is completely different from all the five layers what does it mean, it means once Swami Vaikananda had a sporting what is called correspondence with Miss Mary Hale and Miss Mary Hale wanted to make a bit of fun of Swamiji so he said Swami teaches this is only paraphrasing I am not telling the exact I don't remember in the form of small poetry so it comes to this Swami everything is God that is what she wrote, immediately the correction came from Swami Vaikananda it is very difficult for gross minds like us to understand what the Upanishad that is what Swami Vaikananda taught was nothing but the embodiment of all the scriptures the essence of all the scriptures not a man called Swami Vaikananda not a person called Sri Ramakrishna or Holy Mother, every rishi every spiritual person, every realised soul is nothing but pure truth.

Swami Vivekananda's Clarification: God is Everything vs Everything is God

Immediately Swamiji started I never taught such a clear principle that everything is God I said God is everything now this really would throw us into confusion so what are you telling Swami I am telling God is everything so is it not equal to say that everything is God there is a vast difference very subtle difference between these two so what is pot number one clay, what is pot number two is clay, so clay is pot number one, clay is pot number two and you can add any number of pots so gold is ornament number one number two, any number of ornaments but an ornament is not gold gold in the form of nama and rupa is an ornament because if it is only gold why do you call it this is a ring, this is a necklace that is a bangle why do you call it by a different name simply call it gold, no, gold is everything clay is everything can't you focus upon the pot and say I am everything no, you are not everything, if there are two pots and if you say I am everything and if you are broken somebody takes a stick and breaks you it doesn't mean the second pot will be broken no, second pot, third pot, fourth pot will remain separate only if you are able to understand or I hope I am able to convey to you pot, the clay as a pot is limited but clay itself is not limited so my body, my mind I am limited but I cannot say I am God because God means everything I don't say I am everything, if I say everything I should not say I am the body, I am the mind so God doesn't say I am the body and mind I am everything, I am not only this body I am everybody or I am nobody nobody also so that is the difference Swami Vivekananda wants to say God is a chair but chair is not God why, a chair is a concept of a limited something God is the concept of unlimitedness so understand with that background that sarva karma that means what, everywhere action.

The Triangular Framework of Creation

And then earlier I mentioned I will just repeat that one and then come back so Srishti can be also viewed in a triangular format this is called Adhyatmika, Adhibhautika and Adhidaivika I am Ishwara is manifesting so what is one angle this body mind complex, this individuality what is the second angle this whole experienceable objective world what is the third angle that which is sustaining in other words I the subject the whole universe is the object is manifesting as me the subject and as the entire outside creation called object at the same time that is called Adhidaivika so without this Adhidaivika it is not possible for anybody to experience anything, creation means this triangle, this triangular format we should always keep in mind then what we are talking will be possible even though at the cost of repetition let me again give the illustration there is the sun and there is me with good eyesight and there is a beautiful tree outside so the sun is called Adhidaivika and me the experience of this object is called Adhyatmika and the tree outside as an object of my experience is called the Adhibhautika now all the tree must be there I am there, tree is there, light is not there sun is not there, there can be no experience, sun is there the tree is there, I am not there that also I cannot experience, sun is there I am there and the tree is not there then also there can be no experience so this interconnectedness of the Adhyatmika, Adhibhautika and Adhidaivika is one triangular mode of what we call this creation why am I mentioning this one now because this mantra four in this Vidya, Sandilya Vidya will become what is called very clear so Brahman is the doer of every action, Brahman is the doer of all actions all actions through the instrumentality body mind, so he is the decider he is the desirer and he is using the instruments called body and mind and he is the object of every one of our desires so every Karma Karma means action, action involves the subject, the object the instruments and the resultant knowledge, this is called Triputi Karta, Karma and Kriya now what, when I do something, I am looking at you what am I telling, I am looking at you but I am not thinking, no God is looking at himself because the looker, the seer is Brahman the seen is Brahman the instrument called the eye and the nerves and the mind and the intellect everything is nothing but the same Brahman and that is what we have to understand Sarva Karma all actions, whether we are doing somebody else is doing, something else is doing, what do I mean by something else supposing the wind is blowing the sun is shining, the rivers are flowing the plants are blossoming, so whatever we see this is all Karma only, the whole universe is nothing but Karma, whole creation is nothing but continuous activity of being born, being born away or changing and finally going back to its road just like every river comes out as lifted up water or as steam and then it is carried by the wind and it descends in the form of the rain starts journey, reaches the ocean again gets lifted up, again comes down in the form of rain so this continuously uninterruptedly from anadi beginningless time without beginning these things are going on and who is doing it it is only God who is doing it it is God who has become the what is called lifter of the water it is God who has become the water it is God again who is coming in the form of the rain, that's why we pray beautiful universal prayers so whenever a sage anything in this creation doing something is Brahman is doing Brahman.

Swami Brahmananda's Example

Swami Brahmanandaji was about to depart this world, he was suffering from intense diabetes and diabetic people they become very thirsty so Swami Brahmanandaji, Raja Maharaj Maharaj became very thirsty he gave him one glass of lemonade Maharaj shalai pour this lemonade into your mouth and then Raja Maharaj replied pour Brahman into Brahman, pour Brahman into Brahman, I the drinker is Brahman a lemonade is also Brahman this is the essence of so that is the idea and with this concept it is easy to understand kama means desire and there are countless creatures are there, they are all desiring and every desire is done by whom by the antaratma because if there is no consciousness there cannot be any mind, there cannot be any body it is the consciousness which becomes conscious I am hungry, I am thirsty I am not happy, I want to become happy so I want to do something to be myself whenever we say I want to be happy it is another way of saying I want to be my own self so sarva kama, wherever you see kama, kama means desire and how do we know because you find out any activity, every activity is the result of a desire so wherever we see some activity there is a desire and wherever there is a desire that desire is nothing but Brahman so the same Brahman, for example a person says I want to eat so the desire of food is Brahman food is Brahman and the act of eating is also Brahman that is called Brahmaarpanam I gave you so many examples also a devotee was watching Sri Ramakrishna he took some food and his hand had taken it to his mouth suddenly the devotee was startled to see a snake came out of his mouth it was a vision remember not real snake and it snatched the food and went inside Sri Ramakrishna was smiling, what does it mean? I am not eating is I provide the food I only descend in the form of the food and I only am the eater of the food and I am the digester of the food everything is done by him only we do not, I do not exist no one, none of us exist that is the idea so Sri Ramakrishna that is the idea.

Understanding Gandha (Smell) and Rasa (Taste)

So Gandha means fragrant something but actually Gandha means smell it could be good smell, it could be bad smell is there something called bad smell? absolutely no, there is nothing called bad smell because whatever does not suit us that is called bad smell some food is getting rotten and it is smelling very badly but you see millions and trillions of insects small creatures crawling all over and for them that very smell of the rotting food decomposing food is the best invitation food is here, desirable food is available let us all grow and even we used to do it I told you many times when we were in our hunting stage when we did not learn how to cook etc any rotten food which gives up the decomposing smell the most welcoming smell in this world even today when we have cooked something well cooked there is a smell whether it is rice or vegetables etc when that pervades our nostrils then our tongue starts mouth starts watering our tongue wants to sit down and enjoy there is nothing good, nothing bad everything is good for some everything is bad for some Rasa, so Rasa here means taste enjoyable something as I gave the example, even a betel nut dung betel for it, if it is a bhakta when it is gathering that dried up dung and it wants to carry, so it starts eating and if it is a devotee it will be doing but we assume that is what it gets tremendous satisfaction and who is getting satisfaction when a dung betel fills its stomach with dung who gets that what is called belching with tremendous satisfaction it is the Narayana within so that betel Narayana for him the food is dung only there is nothing that is that could be despised, that could be hated it may not be suitable to everybody that is a different issue but everything is nothing but Brahma and that is why Bhairavi Brahmani had asked Sri Ramakrishna when she was taking him through the tantric practices taste the feces, taste fish even rotten human flesh and then she said, my child everything is the manifestation of the divine mother.

The Nature of Brahman: Beyond Speech and Agitation

So the Rishi Sandilya concludes everything that we see in this whole creation he is only pervading, he is the subject he is the object, he is the enjoyer he is the instrument of enjoyment and he is the resultant knowledge, he is everything and he says Avaki Vaki means one who could speak one who has got the organ of speech but he is Shrotrasya Shrotram Chakshaha Chakshuho, we have seen in Kena Upanishad, so Avaki means he doesn't have the organ of speech the speech, organ of speech is representative of all the sense organs that means the whole body mind complex so he is everything he is beyond everything Anadara, Adara means person who is absolutely calm, un-agitated Anadara means is the person who is not agitated and when do we get agitated when something unpleasant what we consider unpleasantness to us then we become agitated, nobody becomes agitated when we become, when we are happy only when we are unhappy even the thought of unhappiness makes us agitated but Brahman since he knows I am the killer, I am the killed I am the enjoyer, I am the enjoyed therefore he is experiencing only Ananda, Brahmananda so he remains absolutely what is called calm and quiet that is to say you develop that mental attitude where you are not agitated whatever you experience it is all God who is doing, it has nothing to do with me like say Ramakrishna, so mother Kali bent and then he asked, he came to know it is because of your throat cancer and say Ramakrishna he was not agitated, this is the conclusion.

The Final Declaration and Attainment

Then Sandalya concludes this Sandalya Vidya Sandalya, Sandalya that is to say the person having obtained this knowledge that everything is Brahman, Brahman is only manifesting as this creation I have realized that truth therefore means having given up this body for the first time because there will be no rebirth afterwards I become one with that Brahman and this is the experience that means anybody who does this kind of Upasana, Sandalya Vidya Upasana he will attain to that supreme reality and there will be no more birth, either he attains Brahmaloka and from there he attains to the his own nature or he may become a Jeevan Mukta right here or at the time of giving up the body Vidya Mukti, then once his knowledge becomes complete he there is no return for him, so that is what is Isya Addha Asya, he who has that same faith like Nachiketa, Navichiketa Shastri even the smallest atom size doubt whether I am Brahman or not he who doesn't have that doubt that means he is 100% he knows Aham Brahmasmi because Sarvam Kali Nidam Brahma, I am also Brahma Hasma and there is no doubt about it and the same result will come to anybody who can practice or do this Upasana he will attain exactly to that realization of highest realization of Brahman which is to say Aham Brahmasmi Sarvam Kali Nidam Brahma, iti so thus Sandalya Aha Sandalya Aha, Sandalya proclaimed, Sandalya proclaimed that is to show that the Sandalya Vidya the teaching on Sandalya Vidya has come to an end.

Conclusion and Transition

Now in our next class we will be dealing as what I said the Sambarga Vidya another beautiful Vidya with a beautiful story as a background which we will see in our next class.

Om jananim sharadham deviham

Ramakrishnam jagadgurum

bhaadapadmetayosritva

pranamami mohor mohoho

May Ramakrishna Holy Mother and Swami Vivekananda bless us all with bhakti.

Jai Ramakrishna.